Military wants answers on Afghan attack

Posted on Thursday, July 17, 2008 7:16 PM ET
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By Jim Miklaszewski, NBC News Chief Pentagon Correspondent

U.S. military commanders in Afghanistan have now ordered a formal investigation into last weekend's attack on a remote combat outpost that killed nine American soldiers and wounded 15 more. The commanders not only want to determine how scores of heavily-armed insurgents took the Americans by complete surprise, but exactly who were those enemy forces and how were they able to pull off such a well-coordinated and complex attack.

The outpost in Kunar province had been established only a couple of days before when some 200 insurgents staged the pre-dawn attack with machine-guns, rocket propelled grenades and mortars. Eight of the nine dead were killed in a surveillance tower. A handful of the enemy fighters actually breached the wall to the small compound but were quickly driven back or killed. But two days after the assault, U.S. commanders determined the outpost could not be adequately defended and withdrew all American forces. Reports claim that within hours the post was overrun by Taliban fighters.

Defense officials say commanders called for the formal investigation known in the military as a "fifteen-six" (15-6), to get answers to a series of critical questions: Just how did so many insurgent get so close to the outpost without being detected? Was security and surveillance surrounding the outpost inadequate or did those involved in security fall down on the job?
The insurgents launched the attack from homes, shops and a mosque in the nearby village of Wanat. The villagers themselves had fled the area before the attack. Were they fearful for their lives or did they willingly provide cover for the attackers?

But what troubles U.S. commanders is that this was one of the most sophisticated, well-planned, coordinated and executed attack against American forces in Afghanistan since the start of the war nearly seven years ago. Military officials have described the tactics and manuevers as "first-rate" and suggest that it may not be the last.

U.S. military and intelligence officials say there is increasing evidence that the Taliban, al-Qaida, and a variety of loosely-aligned insurgent groups appear better-trained and better-coordinated in their military operations than ever.

U.S. frustrations mount
Intelligence indicates most are currently being trained in camps across the border in the remote tribal regions of Pakistan. The growing frustration at the Pakistan government's refusal to crackdown on the Taliban and al-Qaida safe havens broke out at the Pentagon this week when Defense Secretary Robert Gates declared, "There is no question that the absence of pressure on the Pakistani side of the border is creating an opportunity for more people to cross the border and to launch attacks." When asked if the U.S. military would launch unilateral strikes against the insurgent camps inside Pakistan, Gates would not rule it out.
Meanwhile, defense officials say Pentagon efforts to send more American troops and equipment to Afghanistan to counter the growing enemy threat there have kicked into "high gear."
The 15-6 investigation underway into the attack should hold those in the U.S. military accountable in the event there was any negligence. But the growing capability and sophistication of the enemy in Afghanistan will be a much harder fix.

Comments

If the Taliban occupied the post right after we left why didn't we attack the site from the air with missles and bombs? Why don't we take advantage of these situations like the Al Quida do? Makes no sense..none whatever! Sure not the Navy I was in!!
Iran, stupid.
When can the United States be at WAR and not take ever action to insure the well being of our soldiers? When any group takes refuge in a place we cannot go we are not at war but playing a game of chance.
Sad that we are putting our boys in harms way KNOWING that we cannot rely on Pakistan's involvement in ensuring that the region stays destabilized and providing cover to Al Qaida and the Taliban. Who is the Taliban ? Nothing more than Pakistani extremists!
You can do all the 15/6's you want but until you contain Pakistan from all sides, NOTHING is going to improve and the vicious cycle will continue. Now Iran has an interest in keeping the southern Afghan area destabilized where it borders Iran. The US will be slowly bled on both fronts and as the Americans are forced to defend themselves
In acomplicated world, simplicity is always the answer.The US has always known that training takes place in the neighboring counties, but we insist on acting as if they are our friends. Waite for the taliban to train cross borders and pick the fight, we will always loose. Pakistan should be cut off until they decide what side they are on. We need them to stop the threat to our borders? They need us to advance their modernization.
I surmise that the newly set up outpost didn't have enough air support or overflight by intelligence drones to see the attack coming.  We need to give these outpost support as they are out at the end of the line.

My question is why we didn't keep arial survellience on sight after we left, waited for " the post (to be) overrun by Taliban fighters " and them bomb the hell out of the site and get all the rats in one place??

I'm a 1st Class Petty Officer, US Navy Seabees OIF VET (2 Tours) and I figured out that after we abandoned the outpost that the rats would over run it.  We missed a great chance to get them all with one shot.
here is your 15-6 answer it was iran iran iran where the attack took place is about 200 miles from iran another war is coming iran
THIS IS A CLASSIC EXAMPLE OF POOR SECURITY, BOTH ON THE PERIMETER AND PATROLLING THE AREA AROUND THE OUTPOST. IT WILL HAPPEN EVERY TIME COMMANDERS AND NCOS DON'T FORCE EXTREME VIGILANCE.
my comments is that Washington Politicians who has no Military experience should bow out and turn the war power of decisions over to the Military commanders in the field.How can you be a Comander or President if you've never been in the Military..Washington is a bunch of airhead buttholes.
This is a tough one which will not lead to easy answers.  Before everyone jumps on the bandwagon that our failure to adequately man or fund the effort in Afghanistan lead directly or indirectly to this attack, we need to get the facts.  This will be relatively easy from our side, but it will be difficult to get the necessary intel. from the area which is now apparently controlled by the Taliban.  Regardless of the outcome of the investigation, the attack and the abandonment of the outpost absolutely point to the need for more focus and more effort before we, and the Afghans, suffer more severe losses.  This is a war we could indeed 'lose' by reason of misplaced priorities.
Our spy satellite watching the IRAQI army would have come in handy at a new fort so close to the border/source.  What were 8 soldiers doing in one watchtower??  Multiple casualties in a downed aircraft are understandable although as tragic, but this is senseless.
What happened and why?  All the soldiers that have or are ready to deploy to the AO need to know.  Lessons learned from this attack need to be shared so it doesn't happen again.  Just like having the firebase wire breached in RVN 40 years ago.
The only blame for this instance lies with the Bush administration - though it is unlikely that the buck will ever reach the president's desk.  America was forced to retreat in Afghanistan because this administration took their eye off the ball by invading Iraq.  Bush did not give our soldiers the resources they needed to defend this base.
It is unfortunate that even after 8 years of deception by Pakistan after 9/11,America will never fully understand the clever two faced policy of pakistan. You have to be one of them ( Pakistan) to comprehend the deception. Pakistan is a common denominator of all terrorism in this world. Do not be surprised if Osama is living in the basement of ISI chief and the pakistan govt knows about it. It is a mistake not to enter Pakistan to eradicte terrorists. It should have been known and done from the day # 1. It hurts we are so powerful and still so naive.
Afghanistan should have been our main focus all along. We need more covert operations across the border into Pakistan if that government will not cooperate with keeping its borders under control.
Bush should never had gone into Iraq.
Remember Mogadishu's "Black Hawk Down" back in the early 90's? The failure is due to improper planning. The 9-11 is due to lack of an effective and coordinated intelligence. Afghanistan is exactly the same thing...lack of an effective and coordinated intelligence. I wrote tons of letters to all concerned leaders and government agencies, unfortunately, these people refused to listen to ordinary people.
In my opinion, our government has put Afghanistan on the back burner for too long.  It has become known here as the forgotten front in the war on terror.  

We as a nation need to give the military the tools and objectives to win the war and then get out of the way to allow the military to do the job they are good at without interferance from polititions.

It would not surprise me to find that these men were sent into harms way without the proper tools to complete the mission.  Increasingly, our troops are tasked with missions that they are too thinly spread to complete with the level of support they are trained to expect.

Now we are seeing the fruits of our apithy, these nine fine soldiers died from it.  Who's fault is this?  I place it squarely on our shoulders as citizens of the US.  We should be pressuring our political leaders to give the troops ALL of the assets they need to finish this war.  Not only in Afghanistan but everywhere an American citizen is threatened.
The 15-6 investigation is a waste of time. It would be demoralizing to the hardworking soldiers whose lives are on the line 24 hours a day in Afghanistan. I have been sending letters the last 4 years to these government agencies and leaders offering them an effective strategies on intelligence that would be 100% controlled by us, when will they start listening? Even VP Cheney forwarded my letter to the CIA, to no avail.
The U.S. military should have used B-52's to turn that former outpost into a smoldering pit of sand 50 feet deep as soon as it was overrun by the Taliban. If they did not than they missed a key opportunity to turn the Taliban's victory and war trophy gathering celebration into a reminder that they are the hunted in this war and not the hunter as they are trying to portray themselves to fellow Muslems. The missed opportunity to destroy the insurgents at the pinnacle of their victory should not be overlooked and could be interpreted as a sign that the military leadership over there is not serious about destroying the Taliban at every opportunity. The death of 9 Americans and the successful over running of a US outpost will do more to motivate the recruiting of new insurgents than all the virgins in the world.
Why are you making such a big deal about one event does the press think nobody is going to be killed. My god if todays press was around at the time of world war 2 we would have lost the war. Can you imagine the reports after iwo jima or the battle of the bulge we would have withdrawn from the war and the Nazi's and the Japanese would be in control of western europe and the pacific. Why is the press not writing about how we are kicking the crap out of these guys in every engagment. The press today is ubbeleviable with there rightous attiude.  
I have a friend from college currently running around the in the mountains of Afghanistan fighting these types of people. When I first heard of this outpost attack, my thoughts instantly shifted to concern for his safety, as if he wasn't in danger previously. He very well could be one of the dead, as of yet, I have no idea. But it makes me wonder: What the hell are we doing over there? I'm not a general or even in the military, but I hope someone is deeply concerned by this attack and is willing to do something about it. If these militants are the sons and brothers of goat herders and mujahideen, I seriously doubt their level of inherent military training is that developed. Someone is coordinating these attacks and training these clowns some advanced tactics. My guess, and it may be speculation, is that the Pakistani Intellience Services are behind this, for reasons involving Muslim brotherhood. When are we going to get tough on Pakistan, start admitting to the American public that they are not our friends, and stop acting like they are an ally. I think that Pakistan has American blood on their hands, and until we start disrespecting them like they're doing to us, they won't think we are serious about ending this problem. Hell, the way it looks to me right now we're not! Its time to put but more boots on the ground over there so that our troops can start locating those boots in some militant's backsides. In actuality, a border is just an arbitrary line, and in this case, it should be treated as such. If the Pakistanis want to stop American troops from crossing the border, let them try to get in the way as they're pursung people over it. They're already impeding our progress in other ways, so why not up the ante?
friends like these guys (Afghans) we don't need.  Their leaders are corupt from Karzi to the lonely traffic police.  I bet they (the Afghani Govt) supplied the tailban the where about, security details, number of troops, ...... to these guys for a fee.I say we don't need friends like these.  let they mess-up their lives.  let them destroy each other! why should we have to care!!  so in reality this is every thing but a beutiful freindship.  with friends like thses who needs enemies!  
Thee were serious mistakes made in the process of deciding to place a post in this location and then abandoning it after an attack. Where was the intelligence that led up to the decision that this was an appropriate place to site an outpost and what protocal allowed an early outpost openning operate w/o the highest level of security in the early days of operation? The decision to abandon the post screams of misjudgements, poor decision-making and flawed leadership. This has to have been many mistakes made here that cost unnecessary casualties. And to what end?

If we did not stay beyond the first few days of the initial attack, what hve we learned about the Taliban strength and local support? Why give the attackers the logistical victory of gaining this camp intact and why the moral victory of having been able driven the Americans so swiftly from this outpost?

Mistakes like this have to be investigated, laid open for all to see and learned from. The military and particularly it's leadership has to be held accountable otherwise the message to our troops is that our commanders make the mistakes and the subordinates are the ones who pay the price. This will lead to troops not only questioning Command but maybe also questioning orders from superiors. Mistakes can & are made but somehting has to be learned here otherwise we've lost yet more American lives in vain.
"But two days after the assault, U.S. commanders determined the outpost could not be adequately defended and withdrew all American forces. Reports claim that within hours the post was overrun by Taliban fighters."

If this was the case, why didn't we perform air strikes and wipe out their presence in the outpost?

As far as I am aware none of the 9-11 hijackers were afghani although their mission was planned there with Bin Laden.  I witnessed 9-11 in NY and while 3,000 americans died we have since killed many times that number of innocent Afghanis through our military operations.  We have no business being there and treating the the afghanis like dirt; attempting to impose our mis-guided values on them, propping up their puppet government and bombing their wedding parties on a regular basis. The U.S. UN and NATO should come up with a diplomatic solution with all parties involved.  We should also stop blindly supporting Israel which already has 150 plus nuclear warheads, make development of alternative fuel technology mandatory and get out of the Middle East.  Maybe that would reduce their hatred.  How would you like to be under foreign military occupation and have your culture regulary disrespected with brute force.  End All war!
Thare is alot of no good going on with the leaders of both afghanistan and Packistan,,They are both in some kind of deal with the Taliban..They are playing both sides of the fence,and we are giving out money for them to do it with..But we must do something with Packistan first
We need to have our congress to declare war. Of course the American public and congress would never do that we will just call it a conflict and carry it on till we finally grow tire of it being a conflict. They bomb us and declare war on us and we just cry about it and do our little dance. Our military and troops are great and congress say you need to do just limited things and will probably, well maybe, back you up. This country needs to get a back bone and declare war and go after them and put countries on notice if you harbor them you will pay the price because we are coming. Intelligence tells us we are very likely to be attacked again - is this not correct. Thats because we have a enemy that is bent on hell to cause us harm and will even send people who will blow themselves up to do it. That because of their declared war against us and their convections to destroy us. Not one person reading this has the convictions to do that or do I expect it. However, we do need to stand up to the fight and give our military every right to go after them 100% with our backing wherever they are. All of this is just bull crap because nothing like that will happen. I remember a long time ago Pear Harbor was bombed and our country and citizens had the back bone to declare war and finish it morally and justified.
Doug, you witnessed NY and the enemy declared war against you and you say OK. I say you experienced military occupation in NY.
Some people's comments are trying to make a comparision between this war and Vietnam. Well let me tell you i was in country in the late 60's and i can assure you this war is not like Vietnam. First of all these people all signed up on there own and chose this way of life. I was drafted, the geopolitical landscape is totally diffrent today than it was some 40 years ago our troops are better trained and equiped and they have all chosen this as there way of life.We need to stick to our guns and hold the line and don't listen to the press whoe poisened the minds of Americans 40 years ago.
I served in afghanistan recently I was operating in helmand.I can tell you personally that this recent attack although successeful was not the first complex attack the taliban has tried in the last two years. The general public never hears about these attacks until massive friendly casualties are sustained. Although I cannot say were and when, complicated attacks have been thwarted dozens of times by coalition forces.I was personally involved in a full scale ground war with the taliban's numbers in the hundreds.But no one heard about it because we KICKED THIER BUTTS!!!!!!!!! My point is now more than ever we need the American people to not become discouraged about afghanistan because of one attack that caused a traggic number of casualties.We have been kicking thier asses and were going to continue fighting the taliban as fierce as ever.
Lets see...sending a small group of Americans into an area to set up a base that never existed with lightly armed police forces that have no buy in to the region they are going into.  Telling the Americans to take care of it with no buy in from their top commanders as they have not gotten out of Kabul to see what is on the ground.  Kind of sounds like Star trek with 'make it so'.  That is not the way to take care of businees.  Lessons learned is something that someone in a plush office can point to, but is not something that we are doing.  President Bush called this a 'war on terror' and no matter where they were, if the countries that were harboring them did not act we would.  What happened to this approach?  when did destroying the terrorist organizations that perpetrated the attack on our citizens become country occupation.  If it takes cross border destruction of the training camps then, unlike the Russians, we should do it.
If they read all of these comments, they will see that the people of America have spoken . . . what's the next step?

JUST DO IT!!
Please forget it for god sake that Pakistan is our ally. Pakistan is the root cause of our terrorism in the world and plays double faced games to get military aid.US foreign policy believes we are using carrot and stick policy with Pakistan and the fact is actually it is other way around and Pakistan is manipulating us.
The sooner we bomb pakistan the better we are.
It has been a long going practice with the muslim terrorist organization to attack across the borders of Pakistan. Kashmire is a long living example.American planners should hve studied this and then planned any operations in Afganistan. A couple of years ago India wanted to fix a similar problem of terrorist organizations having bases in Pak occupied kashmire and attacking India. Secretary Collin Powel rushed to india and convinced theIndian leaders to put off the attack. Now USA should team up with India and put an end to this menace.If USA is succesfull to finish off the terrorist maps in the Tribal Area, the terrorists will then start operating from Pak occupied Kashmire.
A lot of pro-war psychos on this blog today suggesting B52 strikes on the abanbdoned compound (what about the village next door and the people who live there?)and all kinds of other maximum force options. You people need to develop some hobbies (besides guns and nazi paraphnalia)or better yet meditate for a while on the meaning of world peace and the good things that can come for the human race with this. History has shown that no western power has ever successfully won a war in "the Khyber" region.  It's a new millenium; peace should be the wave of the future if we are ever going to advance as a species.  All people are equal in the eyes of god.  What would Jesus Christ think of all of this (and your willingness to murder other human beings)?
The reason we are in the crap we are in now is because of politicians. Not just Republicans, not just Democrats, but both parties! If we had let the military do what they do best, blow stuff up and break things, handed them a blank sheet of paper and told them "here are the rules. you have 2 months max." we would be done already. But this became a political war a long time ago. If the politicians would just back off, stop making this a political war and let us do our job, we woouldn't be over there anymore. Better yet if politicians just disappeared...
I think it sucks that they are looking for U.S. Negligence. It was a well planned attack and we were outnumbered between 4 and 6 to one. The last thing a force that has just suffered greater than 50% casualties needs is someone telling them "mistakes were made, by you." Right or wrong, that force will likely not be in the field for a while after a battle like that, and this criticism accomplishes nothing. I think we can't accept that we can do things right and still occasionally lose. We should be investigating how the Taliban has managed to resupply their RPGs for the past 19 years, since we stopped giving them weapons after they beat the Russians, and they've been fighting ever since. Also; their numbers are being underestimated. I find it very  both hard to believe and an insult to our soldiers that the better armed, better trained NATO force outnumber the Taliban by between 4 and 11 times as many soldiers, and the Taliban is still kicking ass. especially when there is no reason the Taliban could not have 120-150,000 in the border regions (counting all subgroups) since that is the amount they have been arming, and they could field that with the strong support they have from 60% of Pashtuns.
And Serge, just because the US has technological superiority does not mean we're capable of destroying anything instantaneously with no risk.
Our missiles are surprisingly expensive, and the taliban sometimes shoots down helicopters with RPG's, hard but not impossible. Since 9/11 we had lost 68 copters last I checked, and the largest single event casualty incident was when a helicopter was shoot down, a rescue chopper shot down, and then both crews killed by taliban fighters in a valley a S. Afghanistan (16 dead). If the military does not have munitions ready to go, and/or does not want to risk an aerial vehicle and/or its crew, probably multiple vehicles, that is a reasonable, understandable decision.
I am an afghan American.I feel very sad and frustrated that US is  still allowing Pakistan to interfere and commit crimes in Afghanistan.most of afghans are happy to see international comunity is helpping them.majority of problems are cross border terrorist.BORDER BTWEEN afghanistan and Pakistan must be secured in order to see any stability in afghanistan.
This seems to be an old story. Ever since Vietnm, with few exceptions, the millitary has been a reactive force. The military definatly needs to improve it's intel and be mor poractive in dealing with the growing threat in both Afg'stn, and Iraq. If not, we will be there a long time.
We are bogged down in this present fight. What happens when Russia and China go to war, which is not far off, then N. will invade S. Korea, China will try to reclaim Tiawan. Every pea braned dictater will use the distraction to expand their territories and all hell is going to break loose.
We need to get going, get agrressive, and kick son "A" soon and stop screwin' around
why are we there? 9-11? has anyone investigated what you think you know?? Drjudywood.com has the most extensive photo collection  of 9-11, ask anybody what the names of the War Games and what they were described as during 9-11 then watch wtc7 fall on WTC7.net. Ask about the cars on JFK drive, and what happened to them... Are we turning into the United States of Amnesia?
I'm tired of the press and public in general not supporting the effort to defeat the terriosts and Talaban too. Why can we come together as a NATION like in WWII were all American played a role in defeating the Japenese and Germans.
Like or not extreamists that hate us and our way off life will not go away nor can you sit down and have an intelligent convesation with those that are unarmed! (mental)
Mr. Bush how can you face the families of these 9 soldiers, sorry is not enough, enough is enough.
The pain , the anger is huge. My heart goes to the families.
They killed nine guys, we killed 200 guys.  We retreated.

Those difficult statistics have ominous implications for our entire mission in Afghanistan.

They established a price we are not willing to pay to maintain a presence on the field.  Nine KIA. They probably lost more than nine guys just crossing the border through the mountains

Additionally, the news of this attack has probably already replaced their casualties five-fold, while reducing again the enlistment willingness in the US.

The President is paid to define the Mission and to define victory for that mission.

Just about everyone means well, but incompetence this year is even more perilous for our flag than it was in '03. There is just meddling, guessing, bribing some, standing up to others, all  for  shambles of failed and still failing foreign policy.  Those nine brave men were killed to protect Dick Cheney and the Neo-Cons from criticism.  Their deaths have been reported a thousand times, from the Delta to the DMZ, from the Yalu to the Pusan Perimeter.


The persons that are responible for this ure the upper brass. There is so much money wasted to make sure these brass have the finest "accomodations" that is is ridiculous. I will give a good example.
Did you know that the U.S. air force to building a "capsule to house the U.S. military upper brass during flights.This "capsule" will include a flat screen T.V. a bed, a wooden table(which had to be restained due to 1 upper brass not liking the color, swivel leather recliners, (again , these had to be recovered due to 1 upper brass not liking the color) and a full length mirror.

This kind of waste makes me sick to my stomach. All the boys and girls over there dying. This money was appropriated for the war on terrorism.

I hear this kind of waste happens all the time, you can't stop it all. That is a load of .... If this kind of behavior is costing us our children, then we must do something about it. email the senator from your stat of start a petition. Do something to show those kids over there we do "CARE".  Remeber 1 thing, those people on the hill work for you. Make them accountable, let them know in no unceartin terms that we run this country, they are only there to represent the people not to rule over them.

To many times we forget what made this country, the people made the country. Yes, the constitution was written by brillant men, however had it not been for the men willing to die the constitution would not have meant squat.

I implore everyone that reads this to pass it on, have that person pass this last comment on. Spending 1 minute of your life sending an email to your represenitives would be enough to bring more of our kids home. Is 1 life worth 1 minute of your time?
You wish this was vietnam.

Americans should have done their homework before deciding to colonialize the only nation on the fase of the earth that is known never to surrender.

Since Alexander the Great, the Pashtuns have resisted foreign aggressors with great succes.
The Moghuls, the British and the Russians followed.

Nuke Afghanistan and see if you win anything.
Just like we provided training & weapons for Iraqis to fight Al-Qaeda in Iraq we provided training & weapons for Afghans to fight against Russia in the 80s. We are all about temp. solutions but stop caring so long as we get what we want RIGHT NOW!!! What we did in Afghanistan in the 80s is what we are paying for and history does seem to have a habit of repeating itself.
Interesting how the press is playing this attack.  My husband is currently in Afghanistan mentoring Afghan officers through the DOD. Word is that the "camp" was a series of holes and vehicles and for 3 days the soldiers really didn't dig in and fortify their position.  Yes, we took causalties, but we also did a lot of damage to those attacking, many of which were young boys conscriped by the Taliban.  Yes, the Army wants answers - probably from the Lt officers commanding our troops and why they didn't do a better or more serious job!
There are soilders in kuwait with little or no reason to be there.. i rather help my brother's and sister's. Than be here.. 4th SUS
A sincere suggestion:
Vietnam and Iraq could be opted to perform  new and affordable experiments, but, believe me or not, Afghanistan is not a good place to perform such experiments. For British Colonialism and  Russian Communism Afghanistan proved to be the last lethal spot, I am afraid the same thing might happen with so called democratization and globalization. We need to seriously reconsider our approach in Afghanistan and understand that, the more we use Force, the more difficult we will make our job there. Let's opt something other than use against those people who are worriors by birth and simply allergic to the use of force.

Steve, Atlanta, GA


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Deep Background is NBC News’ investigative blog. It covers national security, terrorism, spies, Iraq, and politics, as well as government waste, fraud and abuse. It is edited by NBC News Senior Investigative Producer Jim Popkin.

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